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Karen Tarapata: Well, good evening everyone I guess we'll.

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Karen Tarapata: hope that a few more people will join us in the next couple minutes, but this is the workshop meeting and the upper night Board of Trustees on October 14 2021.

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Karen Tarapata: And tonight we'll be seeing a presentation on the a high level overview of changes to our proposed changes to our land use loves.

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Karen Tarapata: Talk but think we'll wait another three four minutes this.

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is great.

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Karen Tarapata: Oh, another lovely thing is, we have a group of high school students are going to be coming and doing a volunteer day at the preserve when we've had a hillside under tarps for the summer to kill the masons to come guitars put the seeds down and just learn a little native landscape restoration.

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Is.

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gonna be fun to.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: The tarp is such a great visual element, though I have to admit from broadway I mean I love that you know just the big iconic sheep.

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Karen Tarapata: But it'll be somewhere else next year.

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Karen Tarapata: Good it's gonna fold it up put it in the garage and it'll have a new home in another area.

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Karen Tarapata: Right certainly plenty of invasive still grass to get rid of.

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Right.

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Karen Tarapata: We have 10 participants if we get two or three more than I will feel pretty good.

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sylviajeff: i'm just going to jump off for one second I want to check something.

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Karen Tarapata: Certainly Jeff.

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Karen Tarapata: We can certainly always talk about is incredible fall weather.

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Karen Tarapata: last thing after the after the trees were all delivered today I promptly put deer fencing around them all, because I would hate to have a deer buffets before I get them into the correct.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: Yes, right yeah.

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Karen Tarapata: I wasn't even out the driveway.

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Karen Tarapata: stereo yapping with netting.

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Karen Tarapata: and hopefully they will do.

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Karen Tarapata: A new locations.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: didn't know is this supposed to be site plan approval and that care.

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Noelle Wolfson: properties exempt.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: Okay that's good.

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Karen Tarapata: I will definitely send you the perimeter planting plan because it's really quite wonderful.

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sure.

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Karen Tarapata: it's like a 10 year plan.

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Karen Tarapata: Every year.

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Karen Tarapata: Two or three sections and there are 22 sections, so it.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: Was that part of that vision statement booklet or is it, this is separate from that.

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Karen Tarapata: Separate this is me working the landscape or attacked.

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Karen Tarapata: Right to find intrigue reintroduce native species and also create visual buffer between observe and the joining property.

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Karen Tarapata: wanted to create a more intimate experience when you're on the property and also to get the neighbors a little more privacy from visitors in a one on very close to there we are a lot lines.

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sure.

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Karen Tarapata: and hopefully create a lot of habitat, you know I mean we with people going through their the critters that used to be everywhere are talking themselves into smaller spots, so I want to be sure that we create less.

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yeah.

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Karen Tarapata: Alright, is Jeff back.

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sylviajeff: i'm back I know who we need more people to join, I had gotten an email earlier, a few weeks back.

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sylviajeff: With a different link for tonight's meeting, so I wanted to make sure that people weren't on that link.

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sylviajeff: So this is.

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Karen Tarapata: What you might be doing because heather reset the correct link today lift someone had put it into their calendar, they could have had a problem, thank you.

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sylviajeff: that's what I actually did before I joined initially today.

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sylviajeff: But I didn't see anybody that.

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Karen Tarapata: Good Thank you.

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Karen Tarapata: i'm going to turn this over then to Noel if this is, if this is our audience tonight is our audience tonight and the presentation will be available on our website.

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Noelle Wolfson: Okay i'm just gonna share my screen and and then we can get started.

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Noelle Wolfson: Okay, so good evening everyone, and thank you for joining tonight's meeting I know most of you know, who I am but for anybody who might want to watch this video after the fact.

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Noelle Wolfson: i'm Noel Wilson consulting Council to the village, and I am consulting Council to the land esports.

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Noelle Wolfson: And, as you know, for the past several years the villages in been involved in a comprehensive planning process and New York law requires zoning laws to be in accordance with a comprehensive plan so in March of 2020 the board of trustees.

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Noelle Wolfson: convened a zoning committee to review the existing zoning law and to make recommendations for changes to bring it in accordance with the new comprehensive plan.

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Noelle Wolfson: The committee consists of mayor terracotta and Deputy Mayor s may and planning board Chairman bill fast and myself, and it is my distinct pleasure to be able to present our work from the last several months to you tonight.

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Noelle Wolfson: My goal is to keep tonight's presentation to under 30 minutes, although I could probably talk about this for three hours.

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Noelle Wolfson: So it's not going to be a very detailed analysis of the proposed zoning law it's really just a high level.

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Noelle Wolfson: Introduction so that you can become familiar with our thinking and process so that, when the draft zoning law becomes available in the next few weeks you'll have the spaces for when you're reviewing it.

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Noelle Wolfson: So i'm implementing the new comprehensive plan, so the comprehensive plan as most of you know, was adopted in August of 2021.

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Noelle Wolfson: And one of my favorite things about the comprehensive plan is at the very last chapter provides.

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Noelle Wolfson: Detailed steps for its implementation and the first step, of course, in implementing a comprehensive plan are these zoning law revisions so there's zoning law revisions that we hope to start in the next few weeks and to take through the winter and to complete in the spring of 2022.

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Noelle Wolfson: So the zoning review committee to go look at the current law, the comprehensive plan issues and administration and implementation that we've been facing in administrating the existing law.

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Noelle Wolfson: And we hope to have the final form in the next few weeks once it's in final form, it will be presented to the board of trustees made available to the public.

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Noelle Wolfson: circulated to other government agencies, the board of trustees will hold a public hearing they'll be you know i'm expecting and hoping for a lot of public comment and discussion.

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Noelle Wolfson: We will have to take undertake a review of the law under the state environmental quality review act and, once all that process is done public input is received revisions are completed the board of trustees can.

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Noelle Wolfson: can consider adopting a revised zoning law, we expect this process to commence soon and to be completed, hopefully, in the spring of 2020.

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Noelle Wolfson: But adopting the zoning law is only the first step in implementing the comprehensive plan so after that, after that process is completed.

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Noelle Wolfson: There are considerations for updating the general ordinances you know, quality of life ordinances local environmental laws.

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Noelle Wolfson: Further planning studies, for example, considering a local waterfront revitalization plan our management plan, maybe some historic preservation analysis and thinking about capital programs and project planning to further the goal of the sustainable community.

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Noelle Wolfson: So just a little history on zoning in the village, the village has had zoning for quite a long time, almost a century, the first zoning law was adapted in 1928.

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Noelle Wolfson: And it was replaced on a wholesale basis with a new zoning law in 1962 and that 1962 zoning law is still the basis for the law that the village uses today.

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Noelle Wolfson: it's been amended and modified several times in the past several decades, and some of those amendments have been significant, but the core of allies that 1962 ordinance.

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Noelle Wolfson: So, since it's been decades since the last comprehensive revision was completed to the zoning law, the zoning committee is proposing a repeal of the 1962 zoning law and a complete replacement.

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Noelle Wolfson: So i'd like to tell you kind of what guided our drafting of this new.

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Noelle Wolfson: zoning law, and I want to highlight some of the notable changes from the 1962 law and then just spend a couple of minutes in talking about the zoning districts.

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Noelle Wolfson: So the first thing is the factors that we considered you know, of course, first and foremost, our New York state and federal law, both the authorization to adapt zoning law and the limitations on that authority imposed by state and federal law.

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Noelle Wolfson: A very, very large consideration in drafting the proposal in law is the comprehensive plan and its goals and objectives for the villages development over the next decade.

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Noelle Wolfson: And we spent a lot of time thinking about clarity and ease of use of the law, you know, making sure that it's organized in a logical fashion, making short terms are defined standards are clear, so that it's clear for board members enforcement officers and.

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Noelle Wolfson: residents and members of the Community.

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Noelle Wolfson: And so I think the first thing to talk about one of the most important aspects of zoning law or the zoning districts right now we have nine zoning districts five residents and for commercial.

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Noelle Wolfson: we're going to pull through the five existing residents districts they're going to be continued and to new residents districts are proposed, and are at conservation district in the south.

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Noelle Wolfson: East Southwest corner of the village and in our 160 residential conservation district in the northern part of the village and.

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Noelle Wolfson: As for the commercial districts, the village Center will be continued the office business will be continued and expanded.

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Noelle Wolfson: The Marine business will be continued the existing laboratory office is proposed to be removed and the Office business to be expanded, for most of the length of night w.

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Noelle Wolfson: roster proposing a new zoning tool in this zoning law and that's the concept of an overlay district to overlay districts in fact.

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Noelle Wolfson: One called the Hudson river overlay district running the length of the village from North broadway to the Hudson river and.

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Noelle Wolfson: Another about nine w for some of the residential subdivisions along nine w which i'll talk a little bit more about when we get to the office business district.

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Noelle Wolfson: For those of you, that are not familiar with what an overlay district is.

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Noelle Wolfson: It is a zoning district that sits on top of an underlying district and properties that fall within that district are subject to the regulations of both the underlying and the overlays zone, so it allows you to have more flexibility or address certain issues.

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Noelle Wolfson: And it's it's a commonly used owning tool so.

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Michael Williams: Just to show you our existing service.

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Michael Williams: Max.

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Noelle Wolfson: And as you can see, most of the village is.

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Noelle Wolfson: um.

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Noelle Wolfson: We have our.

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Noelle Wolfson: village Center district.

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Michael Williams: villages in a residence district.

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Noelle Wolfson: i'm going to show you a map, this is, this is not a the proposed final zoning now.

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Noelle Wolfson: This is a map from the comprehensive plan, but it does a good job of laying out the Hudson river overlay district, and some of the proposed districts.

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Noelle Wolfson: So here is the village and zoning map, you can see all the areas that are not starred will be consistent with their existing zoning so we have our our 10 and our 30.

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Noelle Wolfson: Are seven five, which is the current are five are 10 the current are four so all these will be consistent with the current zoning.

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Noelle Wolfson: We do have some changes so where you see red stars, we have property currently zoned for residents districts being responded to different residents districts so.

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Noelle Wolfson: In this section in the south east corner of the property of the village, we are proposing an amendment of these lots from our for so the our 10,000 square foot minimum lot area to the are 30 just to kind of make them consistent with the other properties fronting on the river.

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Noelle Wolfson: We have that proposed are at conservation district in the South West portion of the village kind of adjacent to the.

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district in the town of clark's town kind of providing a transition to our more dense residents and commercial districts.

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We have the.

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Noelle Wolfson: In the northern part of the village.

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Noelle Wolfson: Here in the purple star, we have the existing elmo district, which will be eliminated and combined with the Ob district.

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Noelle Wolfson: The Green star here, this is property that is currently zoned residential and it's supposed to be located into the Ob district this lot right here it's going to bisected by.

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Noelle Wolfson: zoning district lines, so it kind of makes sense to incorporate it into the Ob and have the property have one zoning designation and the blue stars here are the residential subdivisions along nine who will be a part of that residential subdivision overlay district.

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Noelle Wolfson: So some of the additional generally applicable changes.

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Noelle Wolfson: Are we are proposing the use of use book and parking tables at the end of the zoning law right now the laws kind of a mix of having that the use in bulk regulations.

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Noelle Wolfson: In the text of the ordinance and in table form in a different section, and it can get a little confusing so to kind of clarify that, with the use of tables.

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Noelle Wolfson: To really revamp our site plan review standards and criteria to provide more detailed and comprehensive standards for the site plan review process with the hope that that will make it more.

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Noelle Wolfson: accessible for applicants to prepare plans and more streamlined for the board to review them.

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Noelle Wolfson: And we are proposing an expanded definition section to ensure clarity and consistency of interpretation of the code.

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Noelle Wolfson: And also threw out the code use of define terms start with the initial caps, so that people know that if they're saying a word with initial capsaicin reference the definition section to understand the prediction that they're reading.

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Noelle Wolfson: we're proposing to move certain portions of the existing zoning law into separate local laws.

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Noelle Wolfson: we've done some of this already so the tree preservation law, the IRB enabling legislation.

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Noelle Wolfson: we're also proposing to move subdivision regulations and stormwater management into separate local laws, the reason for this is just kind of ease of use, so that if you are seeking a tree removal permit only or.

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Noelle Wolfson: Having a stormwater management issue you don't need to kind of go through the entire zoning law, and you can go to those specific laws, it also makes it a little bit more streamlined to amend those things separately from the Sony law.

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Noelle Wolfson: And we're proposing revised and expanded non conforming euston bulk provisions to clarify those sections of the code.

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Noelle Wolfson: we're adapting proposing to adapt, a concept of net lot area on a village wide basis as the basis for lot area as opposed to gross lot area.

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Noelle Wolfson: The difference being gross lot areas, the entire area of a lot, whereas network deduct certain areas of environmentally sensitive features, because that does have the potential to make some lots non conforming we've tried to address that issue in the nonconforming he's in bulk section.

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Noelle Wolfson: we're also proposing revisions to the steep slope regulations in accordance with a recommendation from the comprehensive plan to make a three tiered approach to slope, starting with regulation at 15% slopes, all the way up to 40%.

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Noelle Wolfson: Some additional.

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Noelle Wolfson: Changes our proposing some new fencing and wall requirements and, in particular, proposing regulation specific to deer fencing which would facilitate putting up dear fencing on properties so providing for eight foot gear fencing inside and rear lot lines and six foot in front lot lines.

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Noelle Wolfson: We are continuing the use of special permits throughout the code and a renewal process after five years, so all special permits would have a duration limitation of five years.

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Noelle Wolfson: we're also providing some additional authority in the law for the planning board to condition approval for commercial, industrial and marine special permits for ongoing monitoring of noise, traffic odors and similar types of impacts.

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Noelle Wolfson: This isn't necessarily a change it's more of a noted consistency, but a couple of years ago, the board of trustees adapted a comprehensive wireless telecommunications facility law to align with updated FCC regulations.

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Noelle Wolfson: And we're really not proposing any changes to those regulations and they remain consistent with the FCC his guidance.

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Noelle Wolfson: And one other item that I did not put in the PowerPoint but didn't want to fail to mention is that in New York.

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Noelle Wolfson: If you have a zoning law, you must have a zoning Board of appeals and we have an excellent zoning Board of appeals and that Board must be authorized to grant use an area variances from provisions of the zoning law.

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Noelle Wolfson: The use and area vendor area variant standards are statewide standards that cannot be modified by municipal government so those will of course continue in the proposed law.

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Noelle Wolfson: So in our residential zoning districts, as I mentioned, when we were taking a look at the maps, most of the residential his own properties will retain their existing zoning classifications.

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Noelle Wolfson: and special permit uses will provide opportunities for a more flexible and diverse range of housing options, this was something that was.

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Noelle Wolfson: prominently featured in the comprehensive plan and that's proposed to be accomplished through multiple willing conversion special permit that's a.

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Noelle Wolfson: mechanism that's currently in the code and that will be retained and the estate use that's currently in the code so that's having multiple residences on a single property and state configuration.

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Noelle Wolfson: will remain in the proposed code there'll be provisions for accessory apartments by special use permit and for short term Rentals by special use permit.

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Noelle Wolfson: we've taken a lot of time to think about all of the.

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Noelle Wolfson: accessory structures and uses, not only to residential properties to all properties, but because the overwhelming majority of property in the villages zoned residential spend a lot of time thinking about residential.

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Noelle Wolfson: accessory structures and thinking about their appropriate setback and bulk requirements so for things like driveways and patios and swimming pools, so that section is greatly expanded and clarified in the in the proposed code, as compared to the existing zoning law.

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Noelle Wolfson: And there will be certain non residential uses permitted in the residents districts wireless telecommunication facilities will be permitted in all districts in the village, as required by federal law.

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Noelle Wolfson: special permit uses will be home occupations places of worship, schools and private membership clubs.

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Noelle Wolfson: In our office business zoning district kind of our district goal is to merge the existing Ob and elmo districts into one district, with an expanded list of uses to encourage commercial development in that area.

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Noelle Wolfson: As the comprehensive plan goes into detail, this is really our main commercial section of the village so.

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Noelle Wolfson: The zoning is trying to implement the comprehensive plans goal of promoting commercial development here while recognizing that these properties are in close proximity to residential uses and ensuring that they're buffered appropriately.

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Noelle Wolfson: And the proposed uses are proposing an expansion of the types of uses in this district so principal permitted uses, which will all be subject to site plan approval from the planning board.

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Noelle Wolfson: Retail establishments personal services establishments banks fitness clubs, medical and veterinary.

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Noelle Wolfson: Professional offices restaurants self storage where has cannabis consumption and sales in accordance with new york's new cannabis law.

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Noelle Wolfson: accessory uses for fabrication production and servicing and table seating.

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Noelle Wolfson: And will continue some special use permit uses like daycare centers light industrial facilities motor vehicle dealerships rental agencies and service facilities senior care facilities places of worship, schools and Community centers.

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Noelle Wolfson: Now, as I mentioned, we do have a few residential subdivisions in the Ob district off of route nine w and they were approved pursuant to a special permit for residential development.

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Noelle Wolfson: That is in the existing zoning law, because the comprehensive plan really encourages commercial development along nine w.

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Noelle Wolfson: It is proposed to remove that special permit for residential development in the nine w corridor since the overwhelming majority of land in the villages already zoned for residential purposes.

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Noelle Wolfson: But we certainly recognize that these are existing and lovely neighborhoods and are providing for them to continue within the contracts of their approval, using the overlay district tool to kind of memorialize and zoning the the approvals for those developments.

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Noelle Wolfson: We have our marine industry, business district, which is a single lot along the river.

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Noelle Wolfson: We will continue to have all uses other than wireless telecommunications facilities permitted, with a special use permit in that district.

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Noelle Wolfson: With regard to the special permit criteria and standards they're generally proposed to be consistent with the existing standards.

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Noelle Wolfson: However, for boat yards club yacht clubs marinas additional provisions to clarify the rules and regulations surrounding the use and storage of heavy equipment and the storage of materials is being proposed and there's no change in the district boundary of this district.

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Noelle Wolfson: Our final district is the small village Center district around village Hall, and so we've given a lot of thought to bulk and parking requirements designed to recognize and foster the continuation of the existing configuration of this district.

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Noelle Wolfson: Most of the uses are by most are permitted by special permit, with the exception of municipal uses in one family dwellings and wireless telecommunications facilities and.

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Noelle Wolfson: The district boundaries of the district are going to remain consistent with with what they currently are so that is my presentation.

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Noelle Wolfson: Very high level overview of the proposed zoning law so i'd love to see if anybody has questions or comments on on the presentation, or on the proposed law or any aspect of the next steps to the implementation of the comprehensive plan.

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Karen Tarapata: Thank you well, that was it's always good to see the direction we're going in a simple form that was very, very clear does anyone have any questions for me about this whole process.

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Paul Curley: Ever I guess the question.

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Paul Curley: um.

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Paul Curley: there's a change a proposed change to allow for accessory apartments via special permit.

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Paul Curley: In what what is the What if someone wants to create an accessory apartment this time, they would go, how would they proceed, I mean the variance or.

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Noelle Wolfson: Sure, so right now that's not a permitted use in the village, so there really is no mechanism, other than a use variance to provide for an accessory apartment and.

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Paul Curley: So the new ordinance would allow that a special permit process, which would be made to the planning board.

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Noelle Wolfson: Correct all the special permits that's a really good point to point out, as proposed, the planning Board will be the body to review all special permit applications that's correct.

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Paul Curley: It was there a sense that that's something that a property owners are interested in doing and are being being sort of forwarded from doing that, at this time.

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Paul Curley: I was just curious why why why it was specifically addressed.

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Noelle Wolfson: Sure that's something that the comprehensive plan um provides kind of.

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Noelle Wolfson: An extensive pretty detailed description of allowing that us to foster.

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Noelle Wolfson: sort of a diversity of housing for economic levels within the village and, that being a tool to accomplish that goal.

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Noelle Wolfson: And so, including it in the zoning laws, you know further into the implementation of the comprehensive plan.

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Paul Curley: There was a sense among the comprehensive planning committee that there was not was wasn't enough.

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Paul Curley: residential options in the lower price range or something like that is that.

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Noelle Wolfson: Would you like to take anyone can, or do you want um I think that it was kind of twofold number one to address that number two to allow for people to remain in their homes and to provide an option for supplemental income to allow people to stay where they are.

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Karen Tarapata: And Noel it does not run with the land.

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Noelle Wolfson: This one would run with the land, although it is subject to the five year renewal period so every five years.

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Noelle Wolfson: The property owner would have to come in and kind of verify their compliance with the special permit and to evaluate whether they're continuing to comply with a special permit standards so that would be back before the planning board for.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: reconsideration every years.

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Karen Tarapata: To make sure that right that was what was what we were told was being done is what's being done.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: Noel and Karen maybe i'll just jump in, and I think in answer to also response to paul's question, maybe even just reading from the comprehensive plan to know how it was stated there, and this fell under some of the goals in the.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: residential alternatives district goal number four affordability and.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: You know in in working through the comprehensive plan we land in in this area, saying, provide an opportunity for Homeowners to stay in their homes longer.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: And the possibility of retaining second and third generation residents, while also providing a mechanism.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: To meet the housing needs of people at various incomes age levels and household compositions and then we listened to appropriate options and and so and we turned it owner occupied accessory apartments which is zoning code is.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: No being written, you know in further and so that that concept.

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Karen Tarapata: I think you're right because the idea was not to create a rental duplex but to have.

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Karen Tarapata: The owner of the home living there, and.

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Karen Tarapata: accessory apartment.

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Karen Tarapata: came from the demographic when we discovered that there was a huge gap in our demographics from i'd have to look at that again, but between.

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Karen Tarapata: We go age.

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Karen Tarapata: The proportion of upper night residence in their 20s is only 5.8% compared to Clark down 10% the upper the proportion of upper neck resident in their 30s is 5.9%.

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Karen Tarapata: Compared to let's say once again Clark towns about 10% nice about 18% so we thought that if there was an opportunity for people to create apartments for their adult children, it could be a benefit, I think, especially special permit process prevents it from becoming just.

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Karen Tarapata: So the soul is rental.

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Paul Curley: I mean, I think it would be interesting to see what standards, the planning board would develop in terms of what whether to approve such a special permit because I could see you having a.

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Paul Curley: unintended consequences if it was kind of like right now all of a sudden.

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Karen Tarapata: Anybody that's that's why this is a high level overview we haven't we will hopefully by the end of the month, have the draft for your review before it ever goes to the public will be out the public, but before the public hearings begin this will all be.

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Karen Tarapata: released, this is just to give you a general high level overview of it and not to go into specific details.

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Karen Tarapata: don't know what to look for when you get your copy that's.

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Paul Curley: Right and, by the way, thank you know well, that was a fantastic presentation, thank you.

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Noelle Wolfson: And it just, just to clarify the standards will actually be in the last so when the board of trustees delegates special use permit authority to a different land use.

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Noelle Wolfson: board the.

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Noelle Wolfson: The special use permit criteria have to be outlined in the law so so that is something that will be right up front in the text that the lie won't be deferred to the planning board to set after the laws adopted.

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Paul Curley: Thank you.

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Karen Tarapata: Are there other questions you'd like to ask and well.

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Karen Tarapata: Well, look at this no 33 minutes.

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Karen Tarapata: Actually, less than that because he's got started late so honestly, we will have this presentation on the website presently probably in.

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Karen Tarapata: And then love soon we'll have the draft circulate to you all, so that we can start to gather your comments, it will be going close to wrapping howdy planning for their comments, so this is still very much a draft that we're working on and and we look forward to your input.

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Okay.

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Karen Tarapata: Thank you all so much I think that's it for our workshop for tonight.

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Karen Tarapata: And we have our regular meeting of the Board of Trustees next Thursday night So hopefully we'll see many of you on that.

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Laurie Dodge: Well, thanks for the presentation tonight.

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sylviajeff: Thank you very much.

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Joe Heider: Thanks very much.

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Noelle Wolfson: Thanks, for attending.

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Karen Tarapata: All right.

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Karen Tarapata: we'll talk soon.

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And neither.

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michael esmay: Karen.

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Karen Tarapata: Yes, Michael I mean.

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michael esmay: What.

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Karen Tarapata: we're still recording Michael.

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michael esmay: Well it's all right, and then but biting my tongue in it that, as far as the accessory apartments goes.

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Karen Tarapata: exist.

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michael esmay: it's an it's been a problem for for as long as i've been involved with the village.

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michael esmay: As a building inspector, I mean it's not something new it's it's it's it's an existing thing that should be legitimized and brought in the into the you know building code regulations, they have to be made safe.

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Karen Tarapata: that's my only fear My biggest concern is somebody getting hurt because they were in an apartment with unsafe conditions, I think this is a way to draw people out of the shadows and legitimize these.

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michael esmay: And I think we're gonna have to do it anyway because of what's going on in Albany.

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Karen Tarapata: Right, you say.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: yeah I think for both those reasons, but like you say like they've they've always existed, they always will exist, but I think now there's a framework for people to do it legitimately safely and then with the con within the context of our or the other elements of our zoning code so.

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Karen Tarapata: yeah yeah so and it isn't our comprehensive plan with all of that review process, so it is if we just yeah.

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Karen Tarapata: Maybe this so.

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michael esmay: My feeling about it is, we have to do it yeah.

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michael esmay: it's not a maybe it's a half to.

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Karen Tarapata: happen because you know i've been wanting to do it, as long as i've been on the board with we've talked about it that's 20.

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michael esmay: Oh yeah.

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Karen Tarapata: buddy Thank you so much.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: So okay.

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You know.

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WILLIAM PFAFF: hey.

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hi.